“Don’t Be a Puppet”: FBI Unveils ‘Violent Extremism’ Video Game for Teens

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Top Tier Gear USA


Months in the making, the FBI has released a low-grade, browser-based online game to try and educate teenagers about the tools used by “violent extremists” for recruitment purposes.

The FBI’s interactive website, called “Don’t Be a Puppet: Pull Back the Curtain on Violent Extremism,” leads a viewer through a series of games and tips in order to teach what methods a radical group might use to recruit them. With each successful answer, scissors cut a puppet’s string until the puppet is free.

Teens can earn an FBI certificate by completing all of the activities.

After all the tips and multiple choice games, there is a free video game called “The Slippery Slope to Violent Extremism.”

Ars Technica reported that “it basically looks like a prequel to the world’s first-ever video game.” In the FBI’s game, players move a running goat left and right using computer keys to avoid hitting blocks, which are supposed to represent violent extremists.

If the goat hits a block, it explodes. There are six levels for the goat to travel. Each level is marked by a finishing line which flashes a distorted logic text featuring purported extremist phrases that would be right at home in George Orwell’s 1984, such as “We must defend our traditions,” “The enemy is responsible for this injustice,” and “Our violent actions will result in a better future.”

n announcing the release of the game last Monday, the FBI said that across America there are “young people who are embracing various forms of violent extremism, actively communicating with violent extremists, and helping with recruitment.” The agency also said teens are “joining violent extremist groups in the US or leaving their families and traveling to war zones…some are plotting and launching attacks in the US and overseas.”

Back in July, The Hill reported the head of the FBI told Senate lawmakers that more than 200 Americans had tried to join Islamic extremists in Iraq and Syria, but the agency admitted those figures were low compared to the several thousand recruited in from other Western nations and the Middle East.

“Whether or not the individuals are affiliated with a foreign terrorist organization and are willing to travel abroad to fight or are inspired by the call to arms to act in their communities, they potentially pose a significant threat to the safety of the United States and US persons,” FBI Director James Comey said in written testimony given during a Senate Intelligence Committee hearing.

The education tool, the agency said, is designed to teach young people what violent extremism is and how it hurts innocent people, and to create awareness about the deceptive power of recruiting tools employed by extreme groups.

The site’s five sections try to explain the following: “What is Violent Extremism, Why Do People Become Violent Extremists? What are Known Violent Extremist Groups? How Do Violent Extremists Make Contact? And Who Do Violent Extremists Affect?”Under “What are Known Violent Extremist Groups,” the FBI lists international groups like the Islamic State, Al-Qaeda, Hezbollah and FARC. Domestically, the agency lists abortion extremists, white supremacists, and environmental and animal rights extremists, among others.

The inclusion of white supremacists and environmental extremists likely came about after the site – which was due to be launched in November – was given an early preview by Muslim, Arab and other religious leaders, who argued that it focused almost exclusively on Islamic extremism.

Under the section “How do Violent Extremists Make Contact,” teenagers are asked to identify, through multiple choice, what kind of invitations are simply social and what kind are more nefarious.

“Click the imaginary post that is most likely a violent extremist looking for new recruits. The right answer will turn green when you select it,” states the page.

The FBI’s right answer for “extremist activity” is an imaginary post that asks, “anyone interested in joining me on a trip next month? I’m heading over to that awful animal testing lab – going to send them a ‘powerful’ message and shut them down once and for all!” An imaginary post reading “Rebecca Smith is attending a political rally” is considered social.

Included in the site is a video message from FBI Director Comey, who explains a further purpose behind the online education tool.

“At the FBI our job is to investigate crimes and to stop terrorists before they harm innocent people. Your job is to educate yourself, to think critically, and be aware of what’s going on around you,” he said.

The FBI is also planning other Youth Programs, including an Adopt-a-School/Junior Agent Program, which puts FBI special agents into local schools to mentor and tutor kids. The FBI said in the last fiscal year that more than 800 teens participated in these programs in 28 different FBI field offices.

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  • It is not Paranoia

    Your job is to educate yourself, to think critically, and be aware of what’s going on around you.

    I tried that once and since that time I don’t believe we live on a
    spinning ball flying throurgh nothing spinning like crazy in all
    directions. I also don’t believe anything the government says.

    I hope that doesn’t make me a violent extremist. I just followed their orders! 🙁

    • Reverend Draco

      It also makes you a bit of a moron.

      • Doc Holliday

        Or…maybe it’s you. 😉

        • Reverend Draco

          Nope. It’s definitely him.

          • Oh lookie here, rev, somebody mimicking my typing style trying to make me look like some pussy that wouldn’t use my own name. Only pussies themselves could think of such a cheap-ass stunt. I bet you it’s my buddy zioman from the basement! I think somebody is trying to jew me and it smells like zioman, he shows up whenever I type flat earth, like a genie only this one is like a recurring, incurable, zionist STD.

          • sunshine

            I must have missed something??

          • Thanks! Whoa, they unblocked it! It used to only go down about 10 posts or so for weeks. His stuff was pretty good IMO and he is taking a LOT of heat for it, brave guy.

          • Gary

            I can verify that. I left the computer for about half an hour one night trying to see below where he posted about “Going back on the meds”. Did they undo the block?

          • It’s blocked again… for me at least it is.

      • sunshine

        Why? What part?

        • Reverend Draco

          The part where he still thinks it’s the 7th century.

        • Gary

          Basically, Bob (or however he spells it), made a bunch of posts proving the Earth is flat (I think disputing with one TV scientist, a Neil De Grass’ole – unsure of spelling), interwoven with some bizarre posts about Vril (reptillians?) and cloning centres for celebrities. Then there was a cryptic post about him “going back on the meds”. About a day later, one going to the site could not read past the “going back on the meds” to see all the flat-Earth stuff.

          • sunshine

            Ahh interesting. Thanks for the explanation.

    • You have freed your mind and no longer prostrate yourself at the feet of freemason high priests and their $cience, quite a feat in this age of controlled thought I must admit… congrats to you!

      More are waking up to this truth every single day, can’t keep staring at that flat horizon LINE and imagining a curve because these rich guys throughout history said so… or can they?

      PS. Watch out for Globalists, LOL!

      • Reverend Draco

        The computer you use to post operates according to “freemason science.”
        So does you car, your refrigerator, your firearms if you have any. . .Free your mind – rid yourself of the charlatanry. . .

        • My car, refrigerator, firearms and computer are examples of technology and they are different than Nasshole asstronomy because they aren’t constructed of easily disprovable lies.

          • Reverend Draco

            Yet they all operate under the same scientific principles.

          • Well, not really because my car, fridge, computers and guns don’t need magical, unproven theories like gravity in order to function while the heliocentric asstronomical model does. What makes you think it is a sphere other than freemasons telling you in their masonic indoctrination centers? Ever seen a curved horizon… nope… and neither have I. I have the proof if you wish to see it and I know a good bit about this topic so feel free to ask.

            Did you know that civil engineers who lay out canals and 1000s of miles of railroad track do not account for ANY curvature in ANY of their projects? The reason for this is if they give into this masonic fantasy their projects would not function so they must remain in reality. Case in point: The Suez Canal, which is 120.11 miles long (some sources say 101 miles) with measurably FLAT, LEVEL water lines on the side for the whole length of it and since water doesn’t curve, not even around big balls that NASA made up, renders it a still-sitting, level structure that proves we live on a plane.

            Let’s do some math to further prove my point and also show you that I have put a lot of time and effort/thought into this:

            The radius of the Earth according the the Nassholes is 3959 miles.(some sources say 3963 but it’s false anyway so it doesn’t really matter)

            A mile is 5280ft.

            So, in order to find the “bulge” in between any two points we must use the pythagorean theorum like this:

            pythagorean theorum = a² + b² = c²
            a = 3959miles (supposed radius of Earth)
            b = 120.11 mi (length of Suez canal (some sources say 101miles but either works for this example))
            c = ?

            a² = 15673681
            b² = 14426.4121
            c² = ?

            15673681 + 14426.4121 = √15688107.4121
            √15688107.4121 = 3960.82155772

            3960.82155772 – 3959 = 1.82155772miles

            1.82155772 * 5280(number of feet in a mile) = 9617.8247616 feet.

            So, the Suez canal, in order for it to exist on our “ball planet,” must have roughly 9,618ft of curvature in 120.11 miles but it is measurably flat!

          • Which were discovered in some cases by masons, but not invented or created by human beings of any kind.

          • Gary

            You don’t think the masons are human?

          • Do you know what a comma is used for?

          • Gary

            I went to a furniture store one time and was told the material in one the mattresses was invented by NASA. Lol. I thought NASA were supposed to be inventing rockets?

            The mattress was about 3x or 4x the price of one of the better mattresses. Needless to say, I avoided the overpriced mattress pupportedly invented by NASA shills.

          • NASA, as a government agency, never invented anything. It was entrepreneurs and engineers that invented everything that NASA contracted them to, being incapable of preventing their managers from killing astronauts through gross incompetence.

        • Heatherfmills2

          ❝my .friend’s mate Is getting 98$. HOURLY. on the internet.❞….two days ago new McLaren. F1 bought after earning 18,512$,,,this was my previous month’s paycheck ,and-a little over, 17k$ Last month ..3-5 h/r of work a days ..with extra open doors & weekly. paychecks.. it’s realy the easiest work I have ever Do.. I Joined This 7 months ago and now making over 87$, p/h.Learn. More right Here!b1219➤➤➤➤➤ http://GlobalSuperEmploymentVacanciesReportsLine/98$hourly…. .❦2:❦2:❦2:❦2:❦2:❦2:❦2:❦2:❦2:❦2:❦2:❦2:❦2:❦2:❦2:❦2:❦2:❦2:❦2:❦2:❦2:❦2:❦2:❦2:❦2:❦2:❦2:❦2:::::!b1219…

        • Gary

          Lol. Freemason science is an oxymoron. Freeman lies, maybe, or observable and repeatable science.

      • Another Thought Criminal

        Really? You don’t think “flat earth” isn’t a psy-op to discredit the whole truth movement?

        • The allegation of it being a psyop is a psyop itself, my what tangled webs we weave when we let spiders into our base. The difference with the flat earth over other conspiracies is that it is easily proven in many ways. The evidence of a flat earth has been staring you in the face your whole life, you just chose to ignore it or rather you have been tricked into ignoring it. The horizon line is flat, it doesn’t bend and never has, you have viewed this flat horizon line many times in your life, our visual perspective is based off of the horizon, when I draw something lifelike I use horizon points… just as it would be in real life, that why they look real/3D.

          We aren’t moving, this picture is proof of that:

          That center dot is Polaris and that pic was taken from Australia which would be impossible on a giant ball with people walking around on it sideways and upside down.

          Been studying this for a while, you got any questions just ask. I’ll probably have my zionist troll buddy showing up soon to tell everyone how dumb I am 😉

          • If you look through a powerful enough pair of binoculars from a high enough vantage, it is easy to see the lateral curvage of the earth, from which a longitudinal curvage can be assumed, since it is visible from the entire rotation.

          • 9) Engineer, W. Winckler was published in the Earth Review regarding
            the Earth’s supposed curvature, stating, As an engineer of many years
            standing, I saw that this absurd allowance is only permitted in school
            . No engineer would dream of allowing anything of the kind. I
            have projected many miles of railways and many more of canals and the
            allowance has not even been thought of, much less allowed for. This
            allowance for curvature means this – that it is 8” for the first mile of
            a canal, and increasing at the ratio by the square of the distance in
            miles; thus a small navigable canal for boats, say 30 miles long, will
            have, by the above rule an allowance for curvature of 600 feet. Think
            of that and then please credit engineers as not being quite such fools.
            Nothing of the sort is allowed. We no more think of allowing 600 feet
            for a line of 30 miles of railway or canal, than of wasting our time
            trying to square the circle.”

          • A geometric plane is two dimensional, becoming three dimensional when curved. If there is a curve, there is a curve, making it a quantitative instead a qualitative question.

          • I am not talking about 2 dimensional planes, I am just talking about flat, 3D surfaces which can also be referred to as planes, like the flat surface we exist on.

          • Geometric planes are never 3 dimensional, by definition. You are talking about a non-geometric plane of existence, which is always 3 dimensional.

          • yes

          • Flat 3D surfaces is oxymoronic. The curve from where you stand is so slight that it only appears flat.

          • If that were true the many examples of lighthouses being able to be observed much farther then they should be able to a on a globular planet the supposed size it is wouldn’t exist.

          • Why can’t one see distant cities from the top of skyscrapers? Which ocean is always as flat as land?

          • One can, lighthouses as well which is concrete proof, why do you struggle with this? I assumed you of all would be able to follow the logic and math, here is calculator: https://dizzib.github.io/earth/curve-calc/ – so why are there lighthouses clearly visible not a little farther than could be on a sphere but much much farther, miles and miles farther than the math dictates?

            All water is level, it is a property of water, it doesn’t bend… ever, not even around really big things. H20 always settles at the lowest point and it always settles completely level, in fact, water levels are the most accurate in the world, so I’ve read.

          • Nothing bends at the molecular level, everything bends at the macro level. When you can demonstrate that all glass bottles are square because glass can’t bend. The key phrase is “so I’ve read,” where only personal observation can prove anything.

          • If the water was bending you wouldn’t be able to see the lighthouses at the distances people report.

          • Or, so you’ve read? Moving water can do very strange things with light, especially incoherent light. Have you ever experienced standing (audio) waves in a room? That is not possible in an anechoic chamber, where echoes don’t exist.

          • No matter how strange it can’t make objects supposedly beneath the field of view because of supposed curvature appear easily viewable. In order for refraction to occur the object must reside in different densities(like air vs. water, the seemingly bent spoon in the glass) which will change the speed of the wavelengths.

          • Visible light occupies such a tiny segment of the electromagnetic spectrum that there is no discernable difference in its speed at different wavelengths.

          • Then refraction doesn’t exist but when I look into a half-full glass of water with a spoon sitting in it I can see it with my own eyes. https://images.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=http%3A%2F%2Ftse4.mm.bing.net%2Fth%3Fid%3DOIP.M035f0bc5bc1cdc84c91285f54380cdabH0%26pid%3D15.1&f=1

          • My eyes tell me that image was Photoshopped.

          • Yes, because the width of the straw wouldn’t be changed by simple refraction.

          • It’s a pencil and yes it would, get a glass and try it.
            Here is where I go the pic: http://www.phy.davidson.edu/FacHome/dmb/EdibleOpticalMaterials/find_n_background.htm

          • If it isn’t round…
            I did all those experiments in both junior and senior high physics, and I doubt that the fluid and the glass in the linked images are homogenous.

          • You have 3 mediums there, the “air,” the glass, and the water and each different density it passes through changes the direction of the light waves which is why a spear fishing dude must aim below his target to spear the fish.

          • Gary

            Lol. Just do the experiment, Einstein.

          • I already did it, Howdy, twice. There is very little point in repeating an experiment if one already understands the physics that it proves.

          • Gary

            Science is about being able to prove one’s theories. Globalists claim the Earth is a sphere. If the Earth is a sphere, the globalists need to offer proof of this claim, or it is nothing more than religion.

          • Science IS the proving of theories, but very few of them have ever been proven by experimentation, experience being a more powerful proof. Columbus knew that he wouldn’t sail off the edge of a flat world, by experience.

          • Being round and being a sphere is like saying that all humans are intelligent.

          • Gary

            The atmosphere is not opaque. As you travel away from a mountain, you will notice it starts turning a shade of blue, the colour of the sky. Eventually, it will be hidden by the atmosphere, sometimes before it is hidden by perspective.

          • Gary

            Like evolution is so slow we can’t observe it, the curve of the Earth is so slight, we can’t measure it?

            That’s religion, not science.

          • Al Mather

            “Engineer, W. Winckler was published in the Earth Review regarding the Earth’s supposed curvature….”
            Made up guy… made up publication.

          • Al Mather

            Ah …The Earth …NOT A GlOBE…. Review…well that pretty much explains it all right there now doesn’t it? LOL! Still no reference as to who Winkler was …

          • Gary

            Ah, there’s the king shill. I was reading through your latest posts, and was wondering when he would pop up.

          • Reverend Draco

            Any 3D image will go 2D with sufficient distance between the observer and the observed.

            The curve is most easily seen from a beach, where one has the entire ocean as a horizon.

          • Wee see different things then because whenever I go it looks like this: https://images.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=http%3A%2F%2Fthumbs.dreamstime.com%2Fz%2Fbeach-horizon-13212116.jpg&f=1
            Which looks flat to me.

          • Interesting theory. I see this mentioned more and more but I can’t quite wrap my head around it. If earth is a plane instead of a sphere, why can’t one travel to the edge?

          • Good question, you CAN travel to the edge, here, here and here are pictures of it, it is a 1-200ft ice wall that surrounds our flat plane. Q: Well then how far does the ice go after the 1-200ft wall? A: that is a terrorist, illegal, thought -crime question, slave!

            Check out this UN logo, they already got the plane divided up for total control!

            All nations of the UN have signed the antarctic treaty forbidding any person from any of the signed countries from ever going there, they all collectively agreed not to mine anything out of there either, if you try to go there on your own and not on a guided tour you WILL be accosted. The south pole does not exist, the North pole does but you can’t go there either, same thing will happen. There has never been a northward/southward flight around the “planet” and there never will be because that is impossible! Well, maybe it’s possible but that depends on how far the ice goes, where it ends, only masons know! There is a ridge at one point at about 300miles inland, it has been claimed/named Rockefeller ridge, nobody “lesser” humans know what is on it.

            Here are some of the only true resources on this topic, many shills and fake flat earthers to side track people and discredit it out there, I even have my own shill assigned to me for posting about it, that’s how “false” it is.

          • Forgot to add these 2, they are best to start with on this topic IMO.
            Free pdf, no entering an email or anything, just click download!
            Flat Earth documentary:

            It’s like a bad car accident, once you see it you can’t un-see it.

          • Fred Bastiat

            Okay, I can’t humor him, trying not to humor him. Curvature and horizon. Its is easy to prove the amount of curvature with simple optics, simple mathmatics, with no need for anything else or any experts.

          • No, you can’t, Fred. Here are pics that prove otherwise: https://images.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.toptenz.net%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2015%2F09%2Fhorizons-flatearth.jpg&f=1
            Super-wide angle shots, all different altitudes, same FLAT horizon LINE.

          • Fred Bastiat

            I’m sorry man, I just know too much and this is a subject I personally tested myself because of an early career. The pictures are beautiful, but they don’t show anything proving flat earth. Look, if you’ve ever seen the top of a tall island and then a ship dropping over the horizon before the taller object your opinion might differ. I repaired and used marine navigational gear, and I’ll swear to you – the earth is curved, you can use basic math to calculate that curvature, thereby derive the circumference of Earth. It’s all rather beautiful in how easy it is for a regular person, with their own equipment, to do something so grand as to calculate the size of the planet on which we live. Nobody is duping you, the Earth is round. Take some time and do the proofs yourself.

          • Take some time and do the proofs yourself.
            I already did, that’s why I am posting this stuff. Here are 200 proofs: http://www.mediafire.com/view/l679prcg097ny8u/200_Proofs_Earth_is_Not_a_Spinning_Ball!.pdf

            Been studying this for the last year so I know a good bit about this also and I have proven myself on this page already although nobody will admit it except for 2 people. I have provided pictures of a flat horizon at all different altitudes, I have posted Eric Dubay’s 200 proofs earth is not a spinning ball as well as his flat earth conspiracy documentary. I have presented the mathematical equations and worked through them so you can see for yourself, I have provided direct quotes from civil engineers who know better, I have presented you with the fact that architects and engineers do NOT allow for any curvature in ANY of their projects! Because of all of this I do not believe there is anything that will make you realize this… you’re not the first and definitely won’t be the last, I can’t say I didn’t try at least.

            I’ll leave you with yet some more facts and quotes that will undoubtedly still be insufficient for you to accept…

            Architects and engineers do not account for ANY curvature in their projects, think about that, they lay railroad track traversing 1000s of miles and build canals 100s of miles long.

            The Suez Canal which connects the Mediterranean Sea with the Gulf of Suez on the Red Sea is a clear proof of the Earth’s and water’s non-convexity. The canal is 100 miles long and without any locks so the water within is an uninterrupted continuation of the Mediterranean Sea
            to the Red Sea. When it was constructed, the Earth’s supposed curvature was not taken into account, it was dug along a horizontal datum line 26 feet below sea-level, passing through several lakes from one sea to the other, with the datum line and the water’s surface running perfectly
            parallel over the 100 miles. The average level of the Mediterranean is 6 inches above the Red Sea, while the floodtides in the Red Sea rise 4 feet above the highest and drop 3 feet below the lowest in the Mediterranean,making the half-tide level of the Red Sea, the surface of the Mediterranean Sea, and the 100 miles of water in the canal, all a clear continuation of the same horizontal line! Were they instead the supposed curved line of globe-Earthers, the water in the center of the canal would be 1666 feet (502 x 8 inches = 1666 feet 8 inches) above the respective Seas on either side!

            Engineer, W. Winckler, wrote into the Earth Review October 1893 regarding the Earth’s supposed curvature, stating, “As an engineer of many years standing, I saw that this absurd allowance is
            only permitted in school books
            . No engineer would dream of allowing anything of the kind. I have projected many miles of railways and many more of canals and the allowance has not even been thought of, much less allowed for. This allowance for curvature means this – that it is 8” for the first mile of a canal, and increasing at the ratio by the square of the distance in miles; thus a small navigable canal for boats, say 30 miles long, will have, by the above rule an allowance for
            curvature of 600 feet. Think of that and then please credit engineers as not being quite such fools. Nothing of the sort is allowed. We no more think of allowing 600 feet for a line of 30 miles of
            railway or canal, than of wasting our time trying to square the circle

            A Surveyor and Engineer of thirty years wrote to the Birmingham Weekly Mercury, Feb. 15th, 1890 stating, “I am thoroughly acquainted with the theory and practice of civil engineering. However bigoted some of our professors may be in the theory of surveying according to the prescribed
            rules, yet it is well known amongst us that such theoretical measurements are INCAPABLE OF ANY PRACTICAL ILLUSTRATION. All our locomotives are designed to run on what may be regarded as TRUE LEVELS or FLATS. There are, of course, partial inclines or gradients here and there, but they are always accurately defined and must be carefully traversed. But anything approaching to eight inches in the mile, increasing as the square of the distance, COULD NOT BE WORKED BY ANY
            ENGINE THAT WAS EVER YET CONSTRUCTED. Taking one station with another all over England and Scotland, it may be stated that all the platforms are ON THE SAME RELATIVE LEVEL. The distance between Eastern and Western coasts of England may be set down as 300 miles. If the
            prescribed curvature was indeed as represented, the central stations at Rugby or Warwick ought to be close upon three miles higher than a chord drawn from the two extremities. If such was the case there is not a driver or stoker within the Kingdom that would be found to take charge
            of the train. We can only laugh at those of your readers who seriously give us credit for such venturesome exploits, as running trains round spherical curves. Horizontal curves on levels are dangerous enough, vertical curves would be a thousand times worse, and with our rolling
            stock constructed as at present physically impossible.”
            source: http://ifers.ace.st/t51-architects-and-engineers-for-flat-earth-truth

            I could keep going on and on and it’ll never be enough… to each their own.

          • Al Mather


          • There he is Dun dun DUNNN! Ladies and gentlemen, I present to you, ZIOMAN the zionist kosher shill!!! Wazzup ZIOMAN? Were you too shy yesterday while attempting to jew me with a fake post mimicking my typing style?

            Wish you would try that bullshit on me in real life 😉

          • Al Mather

            Lol!… you’re losing it! Mimicking your typing style??How’d I do that …type like a complete idiot? … Type with my head up my ass?… Type like a scared little $hit?.. Hey , trust me, I’ll chime in any time I can make you appear more idiotic, but right now you’re doing just fine! Carry on!
            Tell us about how satellites don’t exist..and show us all a map of the flat earth Rolly!

          • If I am so scared why don’t I back down from your punk ass? I knew you would chime in as soon as I typed flat earth like you are paid to but you were too much of a pussy to take me on so, like a coward, you tried to impersonate my writing style to attempt get Reverend Draco to believe I am some kind of scared pussy that would do something like that… guess what? Didin’t work! hahaha

            Doc Holliday Reverend Draco • a day ago
            Or…maybe it’s you. 😉

            What a lame, totally cowardice technique but then again there is no low for a zionist shill like you. Lame on, coward! Lame on!

          • Al Mather

            Impersonate your writing style??? If you mean the stupid little winky face at the end …perhaps Doc Holliday is a 13 yr old girl. It’s not me..not my style & I’m not really sure what ploy or attack on you think it represents??
            When… in any comment I have ever made …in my entire time on Disqus have I defended… or, if my memory serves me…even mentioned Israel?
            Not that it will matter….I know you see “evil masonic Jews” behind every rock and bush..but I’m a Scottish/ lapsed Baptist by heritage.
            I only engage you because you represent the epitome of conspiratorial dumphuckery by parroting your flat earth stupidity.

          • I was just pointing out the attempt, that’s all, and nobody else would have the motivation to something like that but it fits your profile to a “T.” I see you invoke hitler to try to discredit us when on other sites…. cheap trick, I don’t even endorse Hitler(not a fan) but I do expose zionist, BS holohoax lies.

            I assumed your position on Israel and I bet my assumption is correct 🙂

            Evil masonic jews, liars, shills, they are all the same in my book… no good!

            You engage me and try your best to discredit me using ad-homs in lieu of facts but it doesn’t work.

          • Al Mather

            I don’t play sock puppet games.. Rolly/ Gary.
            I don’t invoke Hitler …I have …once… pointed out that right there on IFERS there are Hitler apologists. Trying to rewrite the history of Hitler and the holocaust.

            I did notice you were to pussy to jump into your fellate Earth Schtick over there on the Atlantic with mathematicians and science savvy folks responding & tearing it up.
            Assume away … I’m no defender of Israel.

          • Yes you do, you even have a vaccine shill army that up-votes all of your posts but stopped when I kept calling you out on it, lol! Gary is from another country, fool, he doesn’t even spell words the same way I do, lol, they show up in my auto-correct because of regional differences…. damn, I must really pay attention to details!
            “I did notice you were to pussy to jump into your fellate Earth Schtick
            over there on the Atlantic with mathematicians and science savvy folks
            responding & tearing it up.”
            It’s called a job, Al Mather, I have one that I am very busy at so I have to compartmentalize my time which I did not have any time then so I just read the posts… I don’t get paid to post online, AL Mather.

          • Al Mather

            Yet you post so so much more than me…. The accused “shill”.
            I was just surprised ( not really) … Not often that there is a discussion specifically about Flat Earth… Your big topic… And you just up ticked others as they had there stupidity exposed .

          • Fred Bastiat

            I can tell you love this stuff and I won’t go play by play to shoot down each of your fallacies. My reality is not altered, I had a profession that necessitated an understanding that the earth was round and that other visible planetary objects were round. Without these truths, navigation would have been really screwed.

            I looked at the silly BoB photos of the two cities, I’ve personally calculated the the earth at about 24,901 miles. You should try it, it’s fun! You’re familiar with the Pythagoras theorem? You can look it up. You’ll come up with a surface curvature of 7.98 inches per mile. In the two cities 16 miles apart you’re talking a curvature resulting in a possible curvature of 10.64 foot +/- difference – over 16 miles apart. Recall, the earth has mountains and valleys: the tallest mountain is about 28,000 s.f., while the deepest surface (non-oceanic) valley is about 4,300 feet. The earth is not a perfect oblate spheroid, meaning that in a distance of 16 miles you may not even have a curvature effect. This is the why the ocean is the easiest, since its the least shifting of earth’s mass in ground effects. You really think a curvature effect of 10.64 feet would be visible between two cities, not necessarily on a plane, over 16 miles apart? I can’t tell if I’ve got a picture hung straight sometimes, thank the genuises for laser levels.

            Here’s a snazzy quick link:


            Here, some do it yourself which mirrors some of the previous article: http://www.pbs.org/newshour/updates/7-diy-experiments-b-o-b-the-earth-is-round/

            Again, I lived the curvature of the earth and did navigational measurements using rudimentary equipment that was tested against GPS and we got remarkably close. Good luck.

          • Well, Fred, you can’t go play by play and shoot down each of my proofs which you erroneously call fallacies. I’ll repeat myself, engineers and architects, the guys who build structures like railroads and canals that span 100s of miles that humans use that must be safe and built correctly without any fantasies involved otherwise people would get hurt, do NOT account for ANY curvature in ANY of their projects! Care to explain why that is? If you are so sure of your globular earth then you should be able to easily answer this question. (I wish to provoke thought, not really debate like this but your stuff is erroneous and I am trying to explain it to you which is most likely a futile effort)

            Guess what happens when you use spherical trig for navigation very far south near the ice wall? You’ll get lost like so many other sailors that believed the earth to be a giant ball throughout history in the last 500yrs. The farther south you go the worse it gets for spherical trig, however, if you use plane trigonometry you will not get lost, the reason for this is the latitudinal and longitudinal grid lines are roughly the same in both models in the northern “hemisphere” which is really a hemiplane but as soon as you go past that equator the grid lines for a ball start to converge whereas the grid lines for a plane spread out like a dart board and this makes using spherical trig when sailing really close to the ice wall dangerous business for the sailor, the farther south, the more dangerous. If you are a sailor, don’t bet your life on the ball, I know I wouldn’t.

            ” You’re familiar with the Pythagoras theorem?”

            I sure am and I am wondering why you didn’t use it for your B.o.B example, not sure what you used to get an answer of 10.64 feet but this is how the equation is supposed to be done:

            Pyathagorean theorum = a²+b²= c²

            a = the “radius” of the supposed ball earth which = 3959miles so
            b = 16 – the distance between the two cities
            c = ?

            a² = 15673681
            b² = 256
            c² = ?

            15673681 + 256 = √15673937
            √15673937 = 3959.032331265

            Must subtract the radius in order to determine how much curve there is:
            3959.032331265 – 3959 = 0.032331265 miles

            1 mile = 5280 feet so..
            5280 * 0.032331265 = 170.7090792 ft.

            My memory failed me, I said 174ft, my bad, it’s 171ft!

            You tellin’ me you couldn’t notice a 170ft bulge in between those two points? I beg to differ.

            Here’s a snazzy quick link:

            Thanks to a fellow flat earther named Gary I’ll just post this in response:

            Gary in reply to Andy Sanders 11 days ago

            I have summarised my refutations of the 10 “proofs” the Earth is a ball (from your link) below.

            1. The moon – Lunar eclipses
            “According to the globular theory, a lunar eclipse occurs when the sun, earth, and moon are in a direct line; but it is on record that since about the fifteenth century over fifty eclipses have occurred while both sun and moon have been visible above the horizon.” -F.H. Cook, “The Terrestrial Plane”.

            According to ball-Earth theory, how can a lunar eclipse occur if both the sun and moon are above the horizon? The moon and lunar eclipses are evidence against a ball-Earth.

            2. Ships and the horizon
            Binoculars or a telescope will bring vanished objects (such as ships) back into view once they
            disappear “over the horizon”. That wouldn’t work if they disappeared over the “curve of the ball”.

            The effect of objects disappearing is due to perspective (a coin may become invisible at a mere 100m without any curve effect), but the fact that objects can be brought back into view with optical aids is evidence against the ships disappearing due to a “ball-Earth curve”.

            3. Varying star constellations (Stars change going north or south)
            Stars drop to or rise from the horizon, going north or south, due to perspective. Why can Polaris be seen South of the equator if the Earth is a ball? This can only be explained if the Earth is flat
            (ball-Earthers try to explain it is due to a “wobble” of the Earth, but the alleged “wobble” is neither observable nor measurable – i.e. their “wobble” is not a scientific theory, but an excuse for them to continue clinging to their ball-Earth theory despite it being disproved).

            4. Shadows and sticks
            The argument given by the author here is incorrect, unless the author is supposing the sun is a vast distance away (as is the excuse given for no parallax observed for the stars). Basic trignometry will give a different shadow to the sun for sticks in different positions, as the angle between the tip of the shadow and the top of the stick will give the angle to the sun (obviously different, at different locations).

            5. Seeing farther from higher
            Easily explained on a flat Earth by perspective. The eye can only differentiate angles to a certain amount, which is why telescopes and binoculars can bring invisible objects back into view. By being higher, one can see further as the distance at which the eye can no longer differentiate is further.

            However, on a ball-Earth, there is a specific distance beyond which one could not see, as the curve of the Earth would impede the view. However, there are a number of lighthouses around the world where one can see beyond this distance, because the Earth is not curved.

            6. Ride a plane
            No plane has ever travelled beyond Antarctica (the edge of the Earth). Planes traverse East or West, or even over the North pole, but not over the “South pole”, because there is no “pole”. South is the edge of the disc.

            When I travel in a plane and look out the windows (when the plane is level), I can see land and the horizon out of windows on either side of the plane. This would not happen on a ball-Earth, as the Earth would drop away if it were a ball rather than a flat plane.

            Riding in a plane provides more evidence that the Earth is flat.

            7. Look at Other Planets
            Composition/Division logical fallacy. Just because planets are round does not mean the Earth
            is (I could also argue that the Earth is probably round, just not spherical). Earth is not a planet because planet means “wanderer”, and the Earth is still. Just because I observe zebras at the zoo does not make me a zebra.

            8. The existence of Time zones
            Black/white logical fallacy. Timezones are caused as the sun can only be seen from a given distance before it vanishes over the horizon due to perspective (it travels roughly in a circle on a daily basis, but over a year the circles form a spiral). Places closer to the sun will experience longer days, and further from the sun will experience longer nights. As the sun moves closer or further from the North during the year, the distances vary, resulting in the seasons.

            9. Centre of gravity
            Most of those who believe Earth is flat do not subscribe to the theory of gravity. That is not to say that they don’t believe things appear to fall downward, just that a universal law of gravitation is not the cause.

            If the Earth is a ball, and its accelerating around the sun at the calculated 6mm/s^2 (consistent with the theories of gravity), why can’t we feel or measure this acceleration? We can certainly feel
            and measure acceleration of this magnitude elsewhere, so why can’t we feel it as we move around the sun, if the Earth is moving (rather than the sun moving around Earth?)

            10. Images from space
            I think the only photographic evidence showing the Earth to be a ball has been provided by NASA, a highly suspect organisation (who now claims the Earth is a pear-shape, contrary to their own photographs). They have been caught out lying on numerous occasions and are probably best-known for their moon-landing hoax. I don’t think any reliable photographic
            evidence exists showing Earth to be a ball.

            Linking to PBS for science info is like linking to wikipedia for vaccine info. Man, those points are weak but this is already getting long. I’ll just eliminate number 1: The whole premise of the eclipse is that it is the shadow of the Earth when there are multiple instances recorded of a lunar eclipse appearing before the sun has(both the sun and the eclipsed moon can be observed at the same time) set proving that theory to be completely bunk!

            “Again, I lived the curvature of the earth and did navigational
            measurements using rudimentary equipment that was tested against GPS and
            we got remarkably close. “

            I absolutely believe that you did but the calculation differences are most noticeable very far south of the equator, they are very hard to identify in the northern hemiplane so your calculations would have worked on either model.

            “Good Luck.” Thanks but I don’t need luck when the facts are on my side, they speak for themselves to those who have the ability to comprehend, not saying you don’t have the ability, just that your mind is made up to the point of no more investigation is warranted so like I said there is nothing I can type or show you so we just have to agree to disagree on this one.

          • Fred Bastiat

            You’re killing me, you seem intelligent and am starting to assume you’re pulling my leg. Maybe like Dumb and Dumber2 where the guy pretended for decades to be in a coma just to gag his buddy. I’m not sure how you can go so wrong and not understand. There is an 8″ curvature over 1 mile, meaning the ‘bulge’ would be about 5.33′ with a 16 mile difference: Not 174′. So no, I would not notice a bulge. Sounds like the start to a bad porn movie.

            I’ve traveled 3 oceans and used maritime navigational equipment and you can bet we cared we were on a sphere and not a flat earth.

            “2. Ships and the horizon
            Binoculars or a telescope will bring vanished objects (such as ships) back into view once they
            disappear “over the horizon”. That wouldn’t work if they disappeared over the “curve of the ball”.
            The effect of objects disappearing is due to perspective (a coin may become invisible at a mere 100m without any curve effect), but the fact that objects can be brought back into view with optical aids is evidence against the ships disappearing due to a “ball-Earth curve”.”

            Let’s just stick to this one. How come you can see a taller more distant object, and yet another object disappear over the horizon? How is that not proof of curvature? Saying the word ‘perspective’ makes no sense without further explanation. Yes, you can bring an object into view with optical aids, but once something is over the horizon, no increase in magnification or objective lens size will bring it back into view. An object can be out of view because sight isn’t strong enough, or it can be out of view because it dropped over the horizon. One can be cured by increasing your optical aids, the other cannot, you have to increase your vantage height.

            Nobody can stop you from believing, hell, people believe in all sorts of fairy tales.

          • Al Mather

            Ships that sail away from shore disappear from the bottom up… That is how the ancients first realized the curvature of the Earth.

          • Fred Bastiat

            Yep, Anyone spending a few years at sea gets occasions to watch horizon events displayng curvature.

          • Al Mather

            Careful! By sharing that …you will now be labelled an agent of the secret evil elders of Zion!

          • Reverend Draco

            I grew up within a few miles of the California coast, in the Pismo Beach area. . .

            The curve is noticeable from a chaise on the beach.
            When you watch a ship vanish over the horizon, with the highest point remaining in view for the longest time. . .

            If the earth was flat, the ship would simply vanish all at once.

            Physics for the win.

          • But why can you pull out binoculars and bring the ship right back into view if it is a ball?

            “If the earth was flat, the ship would simply vanish all at once” – no it wouldn’t.

          • Reverend Draco

            Dunno. . . can’t be done.

          • Al Mather

            You can bring a distant ship closer… but they still disappear from the hull up and no more of the hull becomes exposed.

          • Gary

            Its called “waves”, Al. Obscuring the vision. Trigonometry.

            Hold your thumb in front of your eye one time. It can block the sun.

            On a calm, still day, a telescope can even bring back the hull. 🙂

          • Al Mather

            No…A large tall ship will disappear from the hull right to the top of the clearly visible mast and a telescope will not bring back any more of the ship. This has been observed for thousands of years.

          • Gary

            If the highest point remained in view for the longest time, that proves the Earth is flat.

            If the Earth were a sphere, the closest point (e.g. the rear of the ship) would remain in view for the longest time, as the angle of the ship changed (from your perspective) to keep it upright on the water.

          • Reverend Draco

            If the highest point remained in view for the longest time, it proves curvature – otherwise the entire thing would disappear at once.

            Science isn’t your strong point, is it?

          • Correct.

          • Gary

            That’s simple trigonometry and perspective. The ancients weren’t stupid as you make out.

          • Doc Holliday

            Your math is wrong.

          • Go away Al Mather, god damn shill.

          • Al Mather

            Idiot boy…. Why would I try to tell Fred his math is wrong when I agree with everything the guy has said on the topic… And he has agreed with me???
            You are obviously trying to deflect since your stupidity is getting so soundly spanked.

          • Because you are a mutli-account shill, AL Mather.

          • Al Mather

            And the point would be what ? Arguing with the people who agree with me that you flat earth garbage is so painfully stupid…???….
            You are just grasping at lame ad hominems for deflection now…
            I’m a secret agent of the Masons…the Jews.. I’m a shill. Now I have multiple accounts (for an as of yet undetermined purpose??).
            Your desperation is showing Rolly.

          • You’re following me around, I am NOT following you around so who’s desperate again? LOL! Logic FAIL!

          • Al Mather

            I’m right here. Showing( crushing) your flat earth posts (after post)to be the ridiculous crap they are.What would be the point of a sock puppet that agrees with you and argues with the other people I agree with????
            This is YOU trying to deflect from getting spanked.

          • No you’re not, you guys can’t even get that math correct, LOL! Not my fault you all collectively can;t do it either 🙂

          • Gary

            The maths wasn’t wrong Al. Stop deflecting.

          • Oh yeah, how so? Enlighten me, Al Mather, Fred’s calculations are wrong.

          • Al Mather

            Yours are wrong Rolly …the radius is 3950 .. but you can NOT try to account for the curvature by using the surface as your Bside…it must be a tangent.. so your premise is faulty. The 1.8 mile difference would be a tangent @ 90 degrees from the radius. Therefore a point 1.8 miles off the surface 120 miles from point AB.

          • Here is calculator to make it easy for you: https://dizzib.github.io/earth/curve-calc/ – plug in ANY values you want, or, even better, use this to check my math 🙂

            Bye AL Mather!

          • Al Mather

            Not the numbers fool… the 120 miles would have to be a tangent…NOT the surface. Go look up tangent… Then the theorem .. get back to us. Maybe the light bulb will go on.

          • Al Mather

            Very good…now go back and look at your example where you “line 1” was measured on the surface as canal and questioned the lack of curvature …is the light going on yet?

          • That math central example is the EXACT same mathematical logic I used above.

          • Al Mather

            Exact same theorem … But wasn’t your B side the 120 miles of the canal? … Not some tangent shooting off above Earths surface?

          • Gary

            Lol! An argument with globalists ultimately leads to a lesson in basic trigonometry. Very telling. 🙂

          • Gary

            A right angle triangle of a given side length will be tangent to a circle of radius of the same diameter.

            Я0lly’s math wasn’t wrong, but I’m not sure what you’re trying to say. Я0lly basically indicated a 170′ drop over 16 miles, were the Earth a giant ball. No talk of a 1.8 mile difference to my knowledge, or 120 miles from point AB…

          • He was bringing up my suez canal example which was 120.11 miles long and I used the same exact calculations on, it was one of my first replies to Rev. Great stuff by the way. I wasn’t able to be on the last few days, always seem to miss you lately.

          • Al Mather

            It gets worse…According to Flat Earth dumbness… the sun is 30 miles wide and 3000 miles away, stars about the same. They circle over us. All of space exploration is a big hoax, there are no satellites, no ISS, never been an orbit or astronaut. All the world satellite GPS, meteorological observation, satellite data transmission, communications, (military and civilian) from ALL countries is all fake. Done by secret evil masonic Jews who invent, create, manufacture, install and maintain some hidden secret infrastructure to perform all these things with balloons and ground based systems. All the pilots, governments, scientists, NASA, the military, the people who perform the above satellite functions… those who train, recruit and indoctrinate the above agents.. and their families…for decades, hundreds of years, millions of people. ALL keeping the secret.

          • Fred Bastiat

            Dooh! I had not even extrapolated the ramifications of the belief. Wow, jokes on me. I’m a part of the conspiracy keeping everyone in the dark. I’m not sure I even want to know, according to flat earthers why is everyone bothering to lie about the physics of of the world around us/motive?

          • Ummm.. you’re not a shill, Fred… he is.

          • Gary

            You’re not wrong, Я0lly, but popularity is often the price of being right. 🙂

            They’ll get it one day, perhaps… After everybody else has. 😉

          • Fred, here is calculator to help you with your confusion: https://dizzib.github.io/earth/curve-calc/

            Put 0 in for h0 and put 16 in for d0, press calculate, answer = h1 = 170.7175296409332 =- 171 feet, just like I showed you.

            For argument’s sake put in 6 for h0 to represent a 6′ tall adult then put 16 back in there for d0 and press calculate, you’ll get h1 = 112.70825240840932 feet so either way it’s is NOT 10.66 feet!

            If logic of math doesn’t work for you nothing will, to each their own but no matter what you believe you should use a correct mathematical formula… like the one i typed above 🙂

          • Gary

            Fred’s math indicates a flat (albeit sloping) Earth, of 8″ per mile.

            A sphere requires a calculation with height as proportional to the square of the distance, as you indicate.

            But hey, if Fred wants to believe travelling 3 oceans gives him the ability to make up his own mathematics, he’s only kidding himself.

          • Jolly Roger cracks me up.

            I wonder how he explains away images of earth from space.
            Not just from space flights beginning mid 20th century, but currently from several nations’ space stations, and countless satellites orbiting the earth.

            I see two possibilities.

            1. He and others are paid trolls whose assignment is to give people the impression that conspiracy realists are the same as flat-earthers, in order to discredit anyone who calls attention to genuine conspiracies such as 9/11, Sandy Hoax, etc.

            2. The film “Idiocracy” really was a documentary. The result of gubmint edumacation.

          • Bevin, they are fake. Tell me, where are all of the satellites on those pics? Where are all of the stars? Got a picture of a real satellite? Can you show me because I’ve looked and can’t find one :-/

            Here is calculator to help you with the math:

            PS: I’m the one surrounded by gubmint edmuncation, sorry even you do not realize this but alas, that is not my problem.

            So the truth is unpopular, oh well.

          • Charter a large sailboat capable of blue water voyages. Sail in one direction.

            You will wind up right back where you started.

            You can easily ascertain for yourself firsthand that the world is as it is depicted in desktop globes.


            Really, don’t be an idiot.

          • Yes, that is the damn brianwashing tool they roll out in front of you especially before you turn 6. Serious question: I have provided the math and logic along with proof so why do you doubt what I am saying? I can’t believe I am up against this wall with supposedly open minded people, you guys are with me on just about ALL of my other opinions except for NASA and the flat earth stuff to the point where you are accusing me of being a troll who is trying to derail the movement? My history which is clearly visible is evidence to the contrary, Bevin.

            As for sailing, here is how you sail around the world and end up where you started http://testingtheglobe.com/images/EnclosedEarth2.jpg, it’s because you are using a compass that always points north thus you would not be sailing right as sailing right would smack you into the 1-200ft ice wall if you go far south enough(in any direction) but sailing EAST will have you traveling in circles around the north pole that it always point to.

          • In fact, the curvature of the earth shows up in millions of ways daily. One of many is in the Verrazanno Narrows Bridge.

            “Because of the height of the towers (693 ft or 211 m) and their distance apart (4,260 ft or 1,298 m), the curvature of the Earth’s surface had to be taken into account when designing the bridge—the towers are 1 5⁄8 inches (41.275 mm) farther apart at their tops than at their bases; they are not parallel to each other.”

          • “Because of the height of the towers (693 ft or 211 m) and their
            distance apart (4,260 ft or 1,298 m), the curvature of the Earth’s
            surface had to be taken into account when designing the bridge—the
            towers are 1 5⁄8 inches (41.275 mm) farther apart at their tops than at
            their bases; they are not parallel to each other
            .” – then why can’t this phenomenon be observed in buildings in distant cities, why do mountain peaks always point straight up like pyramids in the distance instead of “tilting” to one side or the other or even farther away from the “tilt” when viewed from distances completely impossible on a ball planet?

            The Port Nicholson Light in New Zealand is 420 feet above sea-level and
            visible from 35 miles away which means it should be 220 feet below the
            horizon. The Egerö Light in Norway is 154 feet above high-water and
            visible from 28 statute miles where it should be 230 feet below the
            horizon. The Light at Madras, on the Esplanade, is 132 feet high and
            visible from 28 miles away, where it should be 250 feet below the line
            of sight. The Cordonan Light on the west coast of France is 207 feet
            high and visible from 31 miles away, putting it 280 feet below the line
            of sight. The light at Cape Bonavista, Newfoundland is 150 feet above
            sea-level and visible at 35 miles, where it should be 491 feet below the
            horizon. And the lighthouse steeple of St. Botolph’s Parish Church in
            Boston is 290 feet tall and visible from over 40 miles away, where it
            should be hidden a full 800 feet below the horizon!

            I have endless examples of lighthouses that are clearly visible that are impossible on a ball planet.

            Why is the horizon line flat and eye-level @ 120k feet up? Shouldn’t we observe a round ball 120,000ft beneath us at that height? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tvhFbvY_99o – beautiful video no matter what your belief is and if you fast-forward to 14:45 you just about see the sun.

          • Al Mather

            “I have provided the math and logic along with proof so why do you doubt what I am saying?”
            Your “proofs” are faulty… often purposeful lies.. Your math doesn’t account for things like gravity or scale..You discount the mountain of video and photographic evidence that decades of science and exploration provide.. but you expect everybody to consider a couple images you provide,( with childishly dumb premises like your sun through the trees and clouds), and a collection of cheesy youtube videos as solid empirical evidence.

            A compass doesn’t guide the ship or plane … doesn’t pull it through the constant one direction turns that would be required of your fellate earth delusion.
            Tell us more about that map. You seems to have one according to your comments.

          • Gary

            Unless you sail North or South.

          • The reason you can’t sail north or south is icepacks at the north pole, and Antarctica at the south pole.

            It has nothing to do with any alleged 150 foot high Antarctica ice wall guarded by NASA employees.

          • Gary

            Nobody believes that all Antarctica’s guards are NASA.

            It could simply be the navies of the signatory countries to the Antarctic Treaty (most of whom likely still believe in ball-Earth). If there is nothing to hide in Antarctica, why do all countries agree to make access illegal?

          • Al Mather

            How about this …just maybe…as far fetched as it seems.. the treaty relating to Antarctica is in place for ..and related to …(drum roll please) … the reasons stated in the treaty??There are jobs available right now if you want to sign on to be part of scientific teams, or support .. in Antarctica.
            There are tourist flights crossing over about 1/3 of the continent. From different sides of the continent. If it was all around us the perimeter would be 3-4 times larger than it is.
            This and many other easily disprovable claims relating to a flat earth are why you guys are all too chicken shit to provide a map.
            The picture you idiots post as being the “edge” ( the only “proof” you offer) are just pics of the ice shelfs..there are 3-4 as you look at the map of Antarctica

            Wouldn’t all these military folk come home and say they have been guarding Antarctica?

          • Gary

            Military folk are not paid to think. Even they will tell you this.

            I don’t want a job in Antarctica. I want the freedom to explore, no strings attached, which is not what is offered when applying for a job.

          • Al Mather

            Exactly … They would spill the beans without even realizing they had been guarding ( against no enemy ) the greatest hoax ever perpetrated …. For the secret evil Masonic Jewish fake astronauts!

          • Gary

            Uhhh….. Its no secret. Read about Jarle Andhøy, who has apparently “run afoul of the authorities in Norway, Finland, Russia and New Zealand” for trying to go to Antarctica.


          • Al Mather

            And this proves what?? (Besides your delusion?)

          • Gary

            That its no secret the authorities of the world, the navies, coastguards etc. prohibit access to Antarctica. Its in the papers. You said the military would squeal. Its in the papers – no secret, the military don’t need to squeal.

            They think they’re doing it to enforce a treaty, ’cause some dude doesn’t have insurance, permission etc.

            Amongst other reasons, Antarctica is prohibited because there is likely no midnight sun in Summer (i.e. sun above horizon for days as in the north), demonstrating that ball-Earth is a myth.

          • Al Mather

            Guess what … every ship has to carry that insurance … people have died under this idiot. And yes there is a treaty protecting Antarctica…30,000 people a year still manage to get there along with tourist fly over…nothing is in the papers that in any way supports your ridiculous conspiracy.. thousands upon thousands upon thousands would need to protect Antarctica and not spill the beans… again delusion on parade.

          • Gary

            Do you understand jurisdiction? If one does not want to pay for any good or service, including insurance, its one’s right to choose this, and to live with the consequences.

            “Tourist flyovers” of Antarctica are not that – just flights skirting around it.

            The conspiracy to protect Antarctica would require no more than is already in place – a treaty prohibiting entry, a system (insurance, permissions etc.) identifying potential threats to the secret to neutralise them preferably before they even attempt entry, and a system involving the navies of the world to intercept the one or two individuals (such as Andhøy) who may attempt entry without prior official advertising of the intention. Cast of thousands not required.

            Exploration, like many occupations, is a dangerous career. People die – its part of life. But better to die on one’s feet, than to live on one’s knees.

          • Al Mather

            ” If one does not want to pay for any good or service, including insurance, its one’s right to choose this, and to live with the consequences.”
            What a comfort to the victims of your stupidity when it robs them of property, life or limb…knowing little broke ass you are willing to live with consequences.
            Some tourism takes you on 12 hour direct fly overs and others skiing to the actual pole. Time to update those flat earth “proofs”.

          • Al Mather

            If you provide pictures of satellites… they say fake… if you explain how cameras and light work …they can’t grasp it… they maintain a childish view on gravity…have an undeveloped brains grasp of scale.. and will never realize that no matter what the formula for curvature of the earth… it is still only 8″ over 63,360″ EACH mile.. therefore canals and rail tracks are locally level and flat.

          • Correct.

            The flat earth model is nonsense.

            1. If the earth was a disc instead of a sphere, then any road or railroad track that ran directly east to west along a line of latitude, would curve to the left.

            2. If the earth was a disc instead of a sphere, then distances along lines of latitude would be different above and below the equator. They would be shorter above the equator, and longer below the equator. The length of the Tropic of Cancer would be longer than the length of the Tropic of Capricorn.

            The nonsensical flat earth model:


          • Fred Bastiat

            Is there a chance that 1 and 2 aren’t mutually exclusive?

          • Keep it up, didn’t you use the calculator, Fred? Here it is: https://dizzib.github.io/earth/curve-calc/
            So now me, the mathematical equation AND the calculator are all wrong?

          • Fred Bastiat

            Please. You seem to care deeply, but I traveled three oceans using maritime navigational gear – we’re on a big ball. Believe it or not. I cannot unlearn what I know to be true. Live and let live.

          • Gary

            Travelling three oceans doesn’t mean you can dictate the rules of maths. 8″ per mile gives a plane, not a sphere.

          • Fred Bastiat

            You don’t understand the Pythagorean Theorem, it won’t take 10 miles to curve 80 inches. That’s not the way curvature works. I was using some rough metrics to explain you won’t see much of a hump with cities just 16 miles apart – not to mention the earth’s surface has its own topography ranging from 24,000′ mountains and 5000′ valley’s. I have personally seen some very tall mountains in Colorado and saw a vey deep valley in Arizona, if you doubt topography you should travel and see for yourself. It’s bumpy out there.

            There are math forums to come out you ears where you can see the 8″ used often with proofs. Have fun.

          • Gary

            You stated “There is an 8″ curvature over 1 mile, meaning the ‘bulge’ would be about 5.33′ with a 16 mile difference: Not 174′.”

            This is incorrect. Feel free to use those maths forums, and you’ll find the 174′ is much closer than the 5.33′ you indicated. Unless you are accepting the Earth is a (flat) sloping plane.

          • Fred Bastiat

            Oh yes, we both flubbed! Sorry, I’d lost serious interest in the flat earth game. I failed to drop it into the equation, meaning I didn’t account for curvature myself. You also made a mistake, you’re dropping in 16 miles, but the question is if there is a visible rise between two cities 16 miles apart. Aren’t we talking mid-point, not entire distance, which would then be two cities 32 miles apart? Sticking with the calculator he provided at 8 miles and 0′ eye height (ground) you’re only looking at a rise of 42 ‘ from the point of origin and a 16’ ‘visible’ rise for a 6′ person. Nothing close to the 174′ by his own calculator: https://dizzib.github.io/earth/curve-calc/

            We can do it outside the calculator though. Interesting though, neither of us are talking about ‘bulge’ in a very defined way if we were drawing. Wouldn’t bulge be the amount of rise of due to a curve from a straight line that connected two points across the curve? You need the straight line, this would especially be true if you were working off varying topography on the sphere.

            Distance d = (Miles*5280), d = 42240
            Radius of Earth r = 3959*5280, r = 20903520
            Distance to horizon, c = sqrt((r+h)*(r+h) – r*r), a = 0
            Distance to horizon (in miles) = c/5280 = 0
            Amount obscured o = sqrt(c*c – 2*c*d + d*d + r*r)-r, o = 42.67740023136139

            So the 42′ is about right in the calculator. Agreed?

            But then if we’re really defining bulge=b, b = r-sqrt(4*r*r – d*d)/2, b 10.669′; so 11′

            Would you say this corrects both our math issues and we’ve arrived at a defined bulge if we’re using a rise of curve from a straight line connecting two points?

          • Al Mather

            From what I have seen of these guys…you just ended the conversation .

          • Fred Bastiat

            Thank you, maybe so, but they seem to really love it. Their motives are still a mystery, to think they beleive every airplane pilot, every ships captain, everyone they think is pretending to be involved in GPS, on and on, those ramifications of a conspiracy are still a true marvel. I wish I’d paid attention sooner, fun once I did; I was just lazy.

          • Gary

            Some airline pilots, captains etc. believe the Earth is flat. Those who don’t are likely generally unaware of the conspiracy.

          • Al Mather

            I’ll bite …Show us one working airline pilot ( not some crop duster) that we can verify, that believes in a flat earth.. that goes on record. No anonymous post on a blog or comment or letter purportedly to be from someone claiming.

          • Gary

            As most people don’t have the benefit of freedom of speech, its rare to have one announce that they believe something to be true that can have a severe impact on their livelihood (hence the anonymity).

            If scientists lose their jobs in the “free” West for announcing that they believe life is created, how much more engineers, airline pilots, captains etc. for announcing the Earth is flat? Whenever such truths are spoken, common sense dictates that it must be done anonymously, until such time true freedom of speech is restored.

          • Al Mather

            How utterly… predictably… lame.
            Good one Gary.

          • Gary


          • Nobody is pretending, Fred, they don’t know, big difference. BTW, did you know that they either shut GPS off or stop displaying it in the southern “hemisphere” across large bodies of water? Go ahead and check ANY flight tracker and you’ll see planes disappearing right off the map after they get a few hundred miles out and suddenly reappear out of nowhere while arriving a few hundred miles close to land. So what does that prove? NOTHING! But it DOES make it awfully convenient for some one wishing to hide something. What is your opinion on this, why would they ALWAYS shut off GPS at a time when it is arguably needed MOST for emergency location purposes… traveling over vast bodies of water?

            …and BTW, in the link in your other example they were debunking material from: http://www.theflatearthsociety.org/cms/index.php – which is a shill, front group. Here are some legitimate resources, LOTS of fakes out there to throw guys like you and the rest who look into it but not too deeply:


            If you are going to debunk at least let it be the material from those sources because they are the ones with the truth basically leading this effort. Debunking flat earth, shill, front groups only helps “them” and wastes your time, all by design of course.

          • John C Carleton

            I enjoy reading what you are talking about. I learned early on , say your area of expertise lies in another area, you want someone who’s area of expertise is in the area you are deficient in running that area. I would be very confutable with you calling the copse air support in where i was.

          • Gary

            I agree the curve would be small. On another site (for the 2 cities 16 miles apart), I believe we calculated a 4 pixel difference, or 2 pixel bulge, based on a few other assumptions. However, the small bulge should be central to every photograph, no matter the direction. This is not observed.

            But exactly my point – something that cannot be observed, cannot be measured and is only accounted for by faith is not science.

          • I stand corrected, my math was calculating amount obscured, not the bulge but the amount obscured still proves my point when speaking of lighthouses and the distance at which they are provably visible that would be impossible on a sphere at the dimensions they report, it just wasn’t the best equation to explain observing the bulge in between 2 points in the distance.

          • LOL!
            There is indeed a chance, now that you mention it!
            I haven’t had such a good laugh in a long time.

          • Al Mather

            Friend emailed me this last night…
            proof by proof refutation of all the “200 Proofs that Eric DuBay is an idiot”…. This guy has patience. Takes you through one by one and explains all the bad math, skewed logic and faulty premises of each of the 200 proofs.

          • I’m about to watch the youtube documentary. I’ll let you know…

          • Fred Bastiat

            You’re a bigger man than me! Maybe you can see why someone would be duped? The pictures were laughable as proof. I started life repairing optical and marine navigational gear: sextants, alidades, periscopes, and binoculars – meaning I had to know how to use them. I did horizon testing on ‘big eyes’ – extremely larged and gas charged binoculars that could easily see the curvature. You could watch vessels drop over the horizon, that point where the curvature became to great to see over it. If you had some distant higher object – like a taller ship or island, you could see the top of the other object as the ship dropped down and out of site. Cool as hell. This doesn’t even get into physic proof, just what a man, with rudimentary equipment and basic math can test for oneself.

          • I just gave you proof but you’re pretending I didn’t sooo… prove what you are saying, Fred, I already proved my point 🙂

          • I’m curious as to why the theory has persisted for centuries. And some of these people appear to be very intelligent.

          • Fred Bastiat

            I can’t understand that either. It’s the most basic math, science, and application of scientific methods. YET, some intelligent appearing people are ferocious with their fallacies that fly in the face of observable and verifiable proofs.

            Oh well, I think believing in the State is worse than believing in a flat earth.

          • John C Carleton

            I have gotten where i just ignore some things, but are people really believing the flat earth BS. I thought that was put to rest when the church stopped burning people alive for saying the earth was round and not flat.

          • Well they don’t use ball earth fantasy when constructing civil engineer projects because they are building structures and need them to work properly, look it up since I know you won’t believe me, it’s true.

          • Reverend Draco

            Over the small distance covered by even the largest C.E. project. . . the curve is measured in fractions of an inch. . .

            Ever build a fence? A fence rail 1/128 of an inch higher on one end than the other makes no structural difference. It’s not even enough of a difference to prevent a latch from working properly.

          • “Over the small distance covered by even the largest C.E. project. . . the curve is measured in fractions of an inch. . .”
            How is this in existence then, it’s a 1056.329 miles long canal?

            Water doesn’t bend and there are water lines along the sides of canals.

            I understand and agree with you about the fence.

          • Al Mather

            Got any reference for this Winkler guy other than some fellate earth site?http://the-uncredibles.tumblr.com/post/130140086164/200-pensb-7-12-railroads-and-canals

          • Check it out, rev: https://dizzib.github.io/earth/curve-calc/ – leave eye height at 0 and put in whatever number you want for distance… all of my calculations are accurate.

            A 30mile long canal MUST have 600.1726495587951 ft. of curvature in order to exist on the elite’s globe.

          • Gary

            Ummmm. Ever heard of railways? Roads? Ocean cabling? Tunnels?

          • Al Mather
          • The London and Northwestern Railway forms a straight line 180 miles long between London and Liverpool. The railroad’s highest point, midway at Birmingham station, is only 240 feet above sea-level. If the world were actually a globe, however, curveting 8 inches per mile squared(◄ mathematical concept you clearly have no grasp on, ), the 180 mile stretch of rail would form an arc with the center point at Birmingham raising a full 5,400 feet above London and Liverpool. Adding the station’s actual height (240 feet) to its
            theoretical inclination (5,400 feet) gives 5,640 feet as the rail’s necessary height on a globe-Earth, more than a thousand feet taller than Ben Nevis, the tallest mountain in Great Britain!

            “In projecting railways on a globe, the datum line would be the arc of a circle corresponding to the latitude of the place.That the datum line for the railway projections is always a horizontal
            line, proves that the general configuration of the world is horizontal. To support the globe theory, the gentlemen of the observatories should call upon the surveyor to prove that he allows the necessary amount for ‘curvature.’ But this is what the learned men dare not do, as it is
            well-known that the allowance for the supposed curvature is never made.”
            –Thomas Winship, “Zetetic Cosmogeny”

            “In a long line, like that of the Great Pacific Railway, extending across North America, the supposed curvature would, of course, be proportionately great, extending to many miles in height, but not one inch was allowed by the engineers for curvature during the whole course of the construction of that vast line of Railway. And, if we think of it, how could it be otherwise? All Railway metals must, of necessity, be straight, for how could any engine or carriage run with
            safety on a convex surface?” –David Wardlaw Scott, “Terra Firma”

          • Al Mather

            Birmingham might be 5,400 feet above the straight line drawn between London and Liverpool (I didn’t do the math, so I havent verified if that number is correct. It doesn’t really matter though because my argument is the same regardless of what that number is), it does not mean that the elevation is 5,400 feet higher because elevation lines follow the curvature of the Earth.

          • Again, use the calculator, above answer = exactly 5167.042310196068 ft.

          • Al Mather

            Doesn’t matter …if we actually connected London To Liverpool by straight tunnel through the earth …Birmingham may be that much above that line… but since the rail is laid ON THE SURFACE and the distance is measured ON THE SURFACE.. and on the surface we account for less than 8 inches over every 63,360 inches ( virtually flat) the track and curvature remains significantly the same (accounting for landscape features)…. NEXT.

          • *sigh* The London and Northwestern Railway forms a straight line 180 miles long between London and Liverpool. The railroad’s highest point, midway at
            Birmingham station, is only 240 feet above sea-level. If the world were actually a globe, however, curveting 8 inches per mile squared.

            8 inches per 63,360² inches!!!!



          • Al Mather

            Elevation is measured from the curved sphere Rolly… Sea level is curved on the sphere.. 8″ over 63,360.” EACH MILE… is effectively level… you guys keep coming up with idiotic proofs based on the same faulty premises. Your math of the curvature may be correct …but the interpretation of how it impacts reality on the surface of the sphere is completely faulty.

          • kfunk937

            Hiya, Al. I gotta ask: as entertaining (for you and certainly to less patient bystanders) and noble debating flat-earthers may be, isn’t engaging Rolly and friends roughly the head::desk equivalent of mutually assured destruction?

            I’m concerned for your noggin and desk btw, in case clarification is needed. ?

          • Al Mather

            Metaphorically speaking …probably.. (my metaphorical desk is WAY more organized than my actual, btw ).. but then again…it’s really just silliness. You stop every once in a while and chuckle in disbelief. The fun of taking the epitome of the hate filled, bigoted, anti science, conspiracy nuts… and forcing them to face their stupidity.

          • Al Mather

            And this is still no acknowledgement of the fact that your previous claim was false. Engineers absolutely take into account the curvature.

          • Depends on what you’re reading now doesn’t it? What about the 621mile long canal in China? You saying it doesn’t exist or that it bends 252449.8367994426 feet?

          • You’re seriously still going on with this sarcastic Poe? Dude, nobody who could string together two syllables at a time actually believes this nonsense, so your only followers are those stupid enough to believe you, and those obsessed with painting you into a corner (like poor Al!)

            Give it up and get a life already.

          • Al Mather

            Fly.. like I told them… this is sport for me. A bit fish in a barrel because of the ridic premise.. but it passes the time if I’m at my desk.

          • I understand. It’s still like pigeon chess, but I get the attraction.

          • Don’t like it? DON”T READ IT! oh, and GFY 🙂

          • Fred Bastiat

            I can’t believe I got sucked in, thats the funny part. I’m chuckling at myself. I crack myself up man.

          • Jolly Roger has got to be putting us on.
            Nobody can possibly be that out of touch with reality, can he?
            How can he possibly not know that millions of people have travelled in the same direction, and wound up circumnavigating the globe?

          • I am not lying. How come flight times are the SAME from east to west as they are from west to east when we are supposedly spinning at 1000mph?

            A Boeing 747’s max speed is 614mph and since the “planet” spins @ roughly 1000mph why do we have Boeing 747’s flying West to East in flights that the plane would not be fast enough to even travel in that direction?

          • Al Mather

            Again…Everything is moving together.. Earth & atmosphere.
            If the plane never takes off it travels 1000mph with the planet and the atmosphere.
            If the plane flies east it is travelling at 1000.mph +614.mph … therefore 614mph faster (and farther) than the Earth (relative to the ground).
            If a plane is flying east to west it travels 614mph against ( less than) the rotation (relative to the ground).
            Not really that difficult.

          • If that were true we would see horizontal streaks in the sky at night moving east to west but all we see are seemingly completely still stars but they do move, the whole sky moves as one, but you need time lapse photography to see it, that why I always link to this: https://images.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=http%3A%2F%2Ftse3.mm.bing.net%2Fth%3Fid%3DOIP.M482c258d10ad27218821f82d1f8d0cdfH0%26pid%3D15.1&f=1 – ain’t no circular star trails possible on a spinning ball moving 1000mph eastward unless you were DIRECTLY beneath Polaris… THINK! Circular star trails = not possible on a spinning object, they would be horizontal.

          • Al Mather

            You obviously have an idiots grasp of scale and perspective.
            THINK! The stars are fixed billions of miles away from Earth .. as we spend 12 hours to slowly turn through the darkness. Their angle relative to our perspective would change like the hour hand of a massive clock in sky as we spin on our axis.

          • Gary

            You imply that one cannot circumnavigate a plane. One can.

          • Al Mather

            Please…..Show us a map of your flat earth so we can see how this would be possible without constantly turning.

          • Gary

            If circumnavigation was impossible without constant turning, it would also be impossible on a sphere. 🙂

          • Al Mather

            Not a constant turning in only one direction as would be required on a flat earth. Your defective answer tells me you understand this . Your CONSTANT refusal to provide a map of the flat earth speaks volumes.

          • A Boeing 747’s max speed is 614mph and since the “planet” spins @
            roughly 1000mph why do we have Boeing 747’s flying West to East in
            flights that the plane would not be fast enough to even travel in that
            direction? Also why are flights times the same in both directions?

          • Al Mather

            Everything is moving together.. Earth & atmosphere.
            If the plane never takes off it travels 1000mph with the planet and the atmosphere.
            If the plane flies east it is travelling at 1000.mph +614.mph … therefore 614mph faster (and farther) than the Earth (relative to the ground).
            If a plane is flying east to west it travels 614mph against ( less than) the rotation (relative to the ground).
            Not really that difficult.

          • Why are there North/Southward facing landing ships as well as East/Westward ones then? How can a plane land on a N/S facing, perpendicular landing strip on a ball spinning 1000mph eastward? Let me guess, because “everything is moving together?” Nope.

        • Razedbywolvs

          If your really seeking the truth changeling convectional wisdom or being discredited wont bother you.

          • Another Thought Criminal

            No, I want everyone to realize what is happening so that they know we have to work together to stop it. So, discrediting truth does,bother me.

          • How is it discrediting the truth when it IS the truth? I have just proven it.

          • Another Thought Criminal

            Well, I wouldn’t say you’ve proven it. I have a lot of respect for much of your comments so don’t want to get in an argument with you, but I believe the flat earth thing is a psy-op.

          • I have not proven it? How else do you need proof? I have pictures, videos, math equations, logic and history for proof. That’s why I post about it after all… because I can prove it. So far actual pictures and math equations are not good enough so what else do you need?

            Here is a free pdf.

          • Gary

            It is. A double-bluff psy-op. Its also the truth.

          • Razedbywolvs

            I want to stop it without having to working together.
            Discrediting the truth also really bothers The Ministry of Truth.

          • Most think they are awake but are not, the hardest mold to break is an invisible, mental one. Since I found this out I can only wonder what else I still believe that isn’t true at all. I’ll never stop looking, that’s for sure.

          • It is not Paranoia

            This is a reply to all your posts.

            You are the man! I have no idea how anyone can think any different, if you present them with all the evidence and even mathematics. There’s just one thing I cannot understand – the people who say that they see the curve – are they paid to say it or they really believe in it? Because there is NO WAY to see the curve. Yet there’s countless people saying how they see the curve on a beach. I don’t!!! It’s not there!! I guess you see what you have in your mind. But put your mind aside and there it is! FLAT FUCKING HORIZON all the time!

            Here’s my thought on this psyop/non-psyop thing. I believe this whole flat earth topic needs to be ridiculed hard in “mainstream” to drive people away. I’m not sure about the B.O.B. – I don’t know if he’s genuine, or just a trigger for Neil Asshole to get on TV and act like a fucking thug from a ghetto (just like every physicist or whatever he is) and SLAM the flat earth bullshit!

            Because I can imagine how every little sheep out there takes him as an authority on a subject they don’t know anything about. And what he says must be right. Because he’s on TV you know!

            Also did you notice this fuzz about gravitational waves? What a coincidence! Just in time when people start questioning existence of gravity. And you can see the globe propaganda on every corner, and it’s these little details that prove to me that there’s TRUTH and it’s just something else from what we’ve been taught.

            C’mon people, dont be pussies, be a little rebellious! Rebel against your own head! It’s not yours anyway! It’s THEIRS.
            People will think you’re crazy on the internet. So fucking what. Is it better to live a lie?? Just try the ASSUMPTION that everything is a lie, that the Earth is flat, that there’s no outer space, that NASA lies about everything, that government lies about everything. Pieces will fit together.

            Haven’t you ever wondered why the world is SO FUCKED UP??? You think it’s like that by itself?? NO!! SOMEBODY is fucking it up!


          • “There’s just one thing I cannot understand – the people who say that they see the curve – are they paid to say it or they really believe in it?”

            I am wondering that myself but I also believe that being indoctrinated can make you believe that left is right, up is down and right is wrong so it’s hard to tell honestly.

            “I’m not sure about the B.O.B. – I don’t know if he’s genuine, or just a trigger for Neil Asshole to get on TV and act like a fucking thug from a ghetto”

            I was thinking the same thing but did you see this post? https://twitter.com/bobatl/status/691411463051804676/photo/1 – that was really good! Also they cut his twitter feed off which is suspicious considering he has more followers that the mainstream news stations do.

            “Also did you notice this fuzz about gravitational waves?”

            No I didn’t… interesting… gonna read about it… sounds like another BS theory to cover for the other BS theories, lol!

            It is good to be around another individual who fearlessly posts the truth in the face of ridicule… it doesn’t go unnoticed.

          • Reverend Draco

            Nice incoherence.
            Get a fucking education.

          • Gary

            I think the curve people see is psychlogical. They put together the panorama view in their head (for a full 360 degree straight line), but interpret it as a curve because they have to move around in a circle to view it completely.

            They do not realise the curve they would need to see to prove the ball-Earth would be always central to their vision (and vertical), not interpreted in their mind (and horizontal).

          • Doc Holliday

            Exactly how I feel.

          • I bet it is, Al Mather the shill.

          • I stick with the math and facts on this one, that’s all one has to do.

          • Jason


        • Gary

          I think its like a double-bluff (i.e. flat-Earth is true, so JWO creates a number of flat-Earth psy-op groups to try to convince legitimate truth-seekers that Earth is a sphere, as the truth-seekers can clearly see the number of fake flat-Earth groups).

          I think perhaps they can sometimes see the future (e.g. Illuminati card game), and try to change it.

          If they create countless psy-op flat-Earth groups, these will serve to discredit the legitimate ones, and if the flat-Earth is finally realised by the majority, the JWO will still have a hand in “leading the opposition” with a few of the psy-op groups under their control.

  • Mike

    Pretty much everything there points to the left. Hmm, imagine that.

  • harry freeloaderII

    Liberalism is listed in the new Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, 5th Edition (DSM-5) as a mental illness.

  • whiteberry

    Our government is made of nothing but violent extremists! Projection theory at work once again… every time you point a finger you have 3 pointing right back at you….

    • As well as one pointing in an entirely different direction.

      • Gary

        That’s called a thumb. 😐

        • A thumb is not a finger? It is usually what separates primates (like us) from the rest of the animal kingdom, which is good because a declining number of us use our brains to do that.

  • Reverend Draco

    Let’s see. . . the State claims ownership of the children.
    The State, using that weak-ass claim as justification, destroys the family unit.
    The State then wonders why children with no family ties are desperate for those ties and will join any – any – group which promises those ties, that sense of belonging. . .

    But the problem is those people, you know – the Middle Easterners. . .

    • Yeah, Israel has to go 🙂

    • The state gets ownership of the children from the adhesion contract known as the marriage license.

  • StevetheHun

    Why is the FBI writing propaganda?

    • What else is their function besides propaganda and setting up fake terror plots? Serious question.

      • StevetheHun

        I think their job is to find out who murdered Justice Scalia, and to capture outlaws like Hillary Clinton.

        • I wish I could see that but don’t believe I ever will.

  • RandyJ/ProudSurvivor

    They must get off on the irony of lecturing young people about not being puppets-while they are indoctrinating them as puppets.

  • groupthink? propaganda? Symbols, blame and distorted principles..??
    You mean our government is a violent extremist??
    say it aint so.

  • Razedbywolvs

    lol. Every one of the methods of propaganda they exposed in the video game is used by there HR department.

  • Oboehner

    I’ll remember that the next time the Army recruiter calls.

  • Jenny Higgs

    So basically, it’s an interactive PSA-type thing?